Tuesday, April 01, 2008

Open Thread

WE'VE MOVED! Democratic Convention Watch is now at http://www.DemocraticConventionWatch.com

What is McCain's latest "senior moment", what does Obama need to do to win in November or whatever else is on your mind.

And please be excellent to one another. We do not accept name calling or any attacks on our commenters. Any objectionable comments will be deleted. Try to be civil.

Thanks!

New Open Thread here
This one is now closed for comments.

4241 comments:

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jean said...

RE Independant Voter
I am voting for Obama.
Yes I put that in writing.
I am not happy about it but it is the only choice.
Great "I am voting Republican" video.
The husband works on me bit by bit.
After 19 years he knows how to get what he wants;)
He has always been registered as an independant.
Is the weather perfect or what.
jean

Uncle John said...

Alert:

Jim Johnson resigned from Sen. Obama's VP search committee.

Reuters story:

http://www.reuters.com/article/
politicsNews/idUSWBT00916720080611

apissedant said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
apissedant said...

At least one of Jim Johnson's interest rates is higher than my home loan, and mine is fixed. What a joke.

Aunt Jean said...

Leah I went to that link that you sent and I liked the last part the best because I totally agreed with her:

There ought to be a special place in hell for companies like drug giant Merck, whose painkiller Vioxx may have killed 55,000 people.
By Arianna Huffington Nov 25, 2004

I was taking vioxx but it upset my stomach and I started taking celbrex which if I'm not mistaken by the same company well to make a long story short in almost put me in complete liver failure. I had 5% function. Boy was I sick and very very orange this was about 6 years ago.The more I look the more I see that Obama and Clinton were very close to the same things. Jean

jean said...

Hello Aunt Jean
Hope all is well.
My neighbor across the street took Celbrex one day and later the ambulance was called. He had total delusions and scared the heck out of us. The doctor said that was the cause. Have you seen the 3 minute comercials for this crap. Saying it is worth the risk.
Just a question. Do you still find it difficult to come to a decision about November?
jean

Emit R Detsaw said...

Hi Aunt Jean,

I was one of those folks that was on Vioxx for awhile. I also got switched to Celebrex. As soon as my regular doctor saw that the "specialist" had given me Vioxx he got me off of it. Luckly we made it off of Vioxx in time. ;o)

No heartattack here, but my wife noticed a mental change in me and gained like 30 lbs when I was on it and some of the other pain meds.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

All of those pharmaceutical commercials that spend three minutes stating what the side effects are should be pulled of the of TV!

The drug companies spend Research and Development money on the commercials and this is one of the things that Obama wants to put a stop to.

If the government gives money or tax breaks to drug companies then the money shouldn't be spent on ads.

Obama/Sebelius '08

stopOBAMAnow said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
apissedant said...

Leah,
Agreed, many drug companies are now spending more money on advertisement than on R&D. Most are letting universities and the federal government do all their research for them now. They're basically just middle men pushing a product at this point.

apissedant said...

or because the only people that use AOL are 80 year olds suffering from alzheimers.

Independent Voter said...

Jean RE Independant Voter
I am voting for Obama.
Yes I put that in writing.
I am not happy about it but it is the only choice.
Great "I am voting Republican" video.
The husband works on me bit by bit.
After 19 years he knows how to get what he wants;)
He has always been registered as an independant.
Is the weather perfect or what.
jean


-----

Jean, I had figured that you would come around, it's Aunt Jean that I think is having a more difficult time, but I think she too is coming around. She has come a VERY long way, when compared to a month ago.

As far as this person who goes by the name "michelle" I think she is probably just a McCain troll trying to stir CHIT up, and if she isn't she will have some splainin' to do to her kids when they get shipped off to war.

I thought that video was absolutely GREAT! I wish TV spots weren't so damned expensive. I think it would great if it aired in all 50 states :)

And YES, the weather is SPECTACULAR! I have a lot of studying to do today, so I'll be popping in here every now and then, but for the most part it won't be too often.

To ALL of our brothers and sisters in the midwest.....BE CAREFUL! Get OUT of the flood zones and stay safe!

Independent Voter said...

Aunt Jean, nice to see you are coming around :)

As far as big pharma, WOW! Did anyone ever actually notice when pharma commercials really hit the airwaves? I remember seeing a few back in the late 90's but then it was in late 2001 and early 2002 when it seemed like they just broke out and started airing them in EVERY commercial cycle. I think one of the first ones I remember seeing that really started the whole thing was Zoloft.

And then shortly after they started then they all had to start disclosing the side effects. You hear the side effects and think WOW which is worse?

Pain meds? Hell no, legalize pot, it's the cure all. LOL

Leah Texas4Obama said...

The Hillary supporters are coming around to support Obama

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/06/11/poll-shows-obama-picking-up-clinton-voters/

.

I think once they ALL realize the stand that McCain takes on the issues they will RUN away from him as fast as they can.

McCain = more WAR and death
McCain = leaving our troops in Iraq
McCain = overturning Roe v. Wade
McCain = tax breaks for the RICH
McCain = The Patriot Act
McCain = Conservative Supreme Court Justices
McCain = 4 more years of the Bush policies
McCain = having a president that can't remember anything
McCain = flip-flopper

VOTE OBAMA to defeat McCain!

Obama/Sebelius '08

MaryP said...

re Vioxx

I'm one of those peole who mourned the day it was withdrawn from the market. I haven't had a pain-free day since I took my last tablet. As a side bonus, it raised y blood pressure slightly. I have such low blood pressure that the slight drop from rising quickly can make me blackout. If I could get black market Vioxx I would do it in a heartbeat. There is no history of heart disease in my family but plenty of my relatives have been crippled by arthritis both rheumatoid and osteo. I'm only 57 but I'm well on my way.

Karen Anne said...

stopOBAMAnow,

For Heaven's sake, Johnson's "corruption" consists of getting a favorable loan rate. Wealthy people always get breaks like that. Companies want their business, and referrals to their friends.

That's about as corrupt as Schwab not charging me an annual fee because I have a balance over their threshold.

The Repubs would be more credible if they actually brought up genuine issues. This stuff just makes them look silly and desperate.

Mike in Maryland said...

Re: regarding the drug companies R&D:

Ever hear the story of AZT, the first drug used for AIDS treatment?

From Wikipedia:
Zidovudine was the first drug approved for the treatment of AIDS and HIV infection. Jerome Horwitz of Barbara Ann Karmanos Cancer Institute and Wayne State University School of Medicine first synthesized AZT in 1964, under a US National Institutes of Health (NIH) grant. AZT was originally intended to treat cancer, but was shelved after it proved ineffective in treating cancer in mice.

In February 1985, Samuel Broder, Hiroaki Mitsuya, and Robert Yarchoan, three scientists in the National Cancer Institute (NCI), collaborating with Janet Rideout and several other scientists at Burroughs Wellcome (now GlaxoSmithKline), started working on it as an AIDS drug. After showing that this drug was an effective agent against HIV in vitro, the team conducted the initial clinical trial that provided evidence that it could increase CD4 counts in AIDS patients.

A placebo-controlled randomized trial of AZT was subsequently conducted by Burroughs-Wellcome, in which it was shown that AZT could prolong the life of patients with AIDS. Burroughs Wellcome Co. filed for a patent on AZT in 1985.


So, the US taxpayer paid for the development of AZT, and then 21 years later, a drug company comes along and patents it, and charges a price that made it almost too expensive for anyone to use. The drug company's excuse for the price? R&D.

I'd like to see an HONEST accountant take a look at the books of any drug company, then publicly tell us how dishonest the company's book are.

Talking about accountants, have you heard the joke about a company hiring a new CFO?

The three finalists were a mathematician, a statistician and an accountant. The asked each the same, single question: "What is 2+4?"

The mathematician responded, "Six."
The statistician responded, "Six, plus or minus 2%."
The accountant responded, "What do you want it to be?"

Guess who got the job?

Mike

Judy Bienvenu said...

stopOBAMAnow appears just as Yamaka disappears?? Hmmm.

Judy Bienvenu said...

Love it -- the hug heard round the world from 2004....

http://www.desertratdemocrat.com/archives/1-mccain_bush_hug.jpg

Judy Bienvenu said...

I'm brushing up on my McCain history from his last campaign for President in 1999.

Here's the nutshell on his wife's drug addiction and how she stole her drugs from her own charity organization:

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/1999/10/18/drugs/

Good read.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

So the list so far of things that Obama could use against McCain but probably won't since Obama has class:

1) The McCain/Bush hug

2) Cindy's drug use

3) Bomb, bomb, bomb Iran

4) "I will veto every single beer..."

5) McCain deserted his first wife

6) McCain finished 3rd from the bottom of his class

7) Keating Five

8)

9)

10)

apissedant said...

Mike,
The drug Taxol has an almost identical life story. Bristol-Meyers made over 12 billion dollars on it, despite the fact that the government found the drug, and conducted almost all of the research on it.

suzihussein22 said...

Fortunately, we have someone who sees the forest and the trees-

http://tinyurl.com/5ovg9v

McCain is desperately scrambling for a few more EVs while Obama is noticing what is going on in our back yard.

Judy Bienvenu said...

Leah:

How about this one?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/22/AR2008022202634_pf.html

Judy Bienvenu said...

Leah: There's also this but it may be a gray area. When he had his medical records released, I don't remember seeing anything saying he was 'cured' from this PTSD?

http://www.usvetdsp.com/dec07/mccain_suicide_ptsd.htm

Emit R Detsaw said...

Um, Leah, Hate to make this correction, but McCain didn't finish 3rd from the bottom. I really hate to make him look better than you have him, but he was 5th from the bottom. LOL

Also if you want to add some Military stuff. He doesn't want to increase the troop strength by using a draft to support the Bush/McCain Iraq war, he wants to extend the troops tours even longer so there are even more suicides and divorces than there are now.

suzihussein22 said...

McCain only rated 2 pinochios on this-

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2008/06/mccain_vs_obama_on_taxes.html

Aunt Jean said...

MaryP

I know what you mean about vioxx it helped so much. But there is something else you can take that does help and that is ultram or toradol. The only bad affect is it can give you bleeding ulcers. So if you have ever had ulcers be careful taking them.What I like about them is they are non narcotic. Ask your Dr. if he has some samples for you to take to see how they work. Hope this helps. Jean

Aunt Jean said...

Jean

how are you this evening? I'm doing pretty well.

You asked me a question was I having a hard time deciding. I'm not going to lie yes. Am I a democrat YES! I can't see me voting for McCain he's to far out there plus I just don't like his policies.So I'm going to keep my eyes and ears open and go from there. I do know that what Obama has said he wanted to do is almost just like Hillary. I still have a deep respect for her and I believe one day she will be president but we have to get thru this one and we don't need McCain in there even for 4 years.

Something has to be done about this country before we the people can start healing and getting our life together for the better.Jean

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Aunt Jean-

Many things that Obama has proposed and Hillary has proposed are 'very' similar.

Their stances on:

Health care
Leaving Iraq
Creating green jobs
College help for students and veterans
Women's right
Civil rights

the list goes on and on.

McCain's position is pretty much the OPPOSITE of Obama and Hillary.

There is an ISSUES tab at the top of BarackObama.com that outlines all of his plans.


WE MUST KEEP McCAIN out of the White House!!!

McCain is ANTI-Women and PRO-War!!!

Obama/Sebelius '08
.

billyjay66 said...

What do you all think of McCain saying that gettin troops out of Iraq is "not important"???? does that make Leah's top ten list?

stopOBAMAnow said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Aunt Jean said...

Leah I agree with you totally. McCain's wife I had already read about her drug problem. She stole some drugs from a place that her family had that helped poor people or something like that. McCain and her family tried to hide it but it got out so she admitted to it but only because she had to.Like daaaa did she think the American people were stupid.Her and McCain got together before he divorced his wife. How sad for her. She's better off without him. Jean

Kujo said...

Stop Obama:

You say that the If we have McCain as president, the terrorist will fear him and so they will not attack us. Do you still stand by this?

Aunt Jean said...

Billyjay

I bet it will. My great nephew is over there he is suppose to come home July 10 I believe. Hope and pray that he stays safe. I can't wait to see him it's been over a year. Jean

Keryl said...

Texas Leah...

You forgot (and these are only things Obama WON'T use:

8. Calling his wife "c" to her face.

9. Voting against civil rights legislation.

10. Calling the radical right crazy

billyjay66 said...

Keith Olberman will do a special comment tomorrow night on McCain's "not important" response. I'll bet he will touch all the bases about all of his Iraq flaps. Alqueda training in Iran, troops already drawn down below pre-surge levels... etc.

Kujo said...

Stop Obama:

Ok What if Putin lead Russia to break into the US computers (like China has done) and disables our nuclear weapons, then attacks and takes over the US,forcing Bush to hang from the gallows because he is a bad guy.

Would you fight back and try to force Russian troups out of US, even create threats for Russia inside its boarders, or would you say that Putin is a tough guy and I am afraid of him so I won't do anything?

Stop Obama = McCain = ignorant policies on Iraq that will cause more hell for the US

OR

Stop Obama = WIMP

justin said...

Quit feeding the troll.

I have found it very liberating to simply scroll past the drivel, never reading a word.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Regarding McCain...

Voting against civil rights legislation.

and saying that

Getting our troops home is not important.

Those two I think he WILL use against McCain because those would be issue related and not personal attacks.

apissedant said...

Stop is repetitive and retarded. Ignore him. There is no converting him, only antagonizing him and forcing us all to read the same crap again and again and again and again and again. And again. There is no appropriate to Carter or Bush, so he gives no evidences, just says Bush=Carter=Obama as if this proves something. He spouts all of the Republican talking points, advocates all of their programs, and still claims he is a Clinton supporter. I smell a Republican. Ignore him please, because I'm tired of reading his garbage. I assume I'm not alone.

GOOD NEWS!!! Newport News just opened a coordinated campaign office. There was no coordinated campaign for the 2000 or 2004 election cycles. The only time I know of one happening was in 2005, when Tim Kaine became Governor. VIRGINIA IS GOING BLUE!!!!

apissedant said...

JUSTIN! THANK YOU! I find it hard to ignore, but honestly... it is the exact same thing over and over. Enough is enough.

apissedant said...

http://howstupidblog.com/
The blog for the dude on The Daily Show today. This guy is cool.

Judy Bienvenu said...

Apissedant & Justin --

The 'stop' guy is Yamaka. It's all the same style of writing, same formating. Yamaka disappears from this site and then the 'stop' guy shows up. It's the same non-stop junk he used to type, only before it would include pro-Hillary comments along with his anti-Obama comments.

I thought Yamaka would come around way before Aunt Jean. But alas, I was wrong. Just goes to show you...you can't judge a book by its cover! Aunt Jean isn't all the way there yet but she's at least thinking about it and acknowledging that the possibility does exist. It's a start.

Hi Yams!! Missed ya! How's the weather in Houston these days?? It's 100 every day in Austin so I figure it's probably about 125 in Houston....with the humidity of course.

justin said...

I was looking at McCains website and found this:

John McCain Proposes A One-Year Spending Pause To Evaluate Programs. He believes that outside of essential military and veterans programs there should be a one-year pause in discretionary spending growth that should be used for a top-to-bottom review of the effectiveness of federal programs.

As I understand it, and hopefull some of you can help me, this includes education, health and human services, energy, agriculture, science.

Being in research this is concerning personally, but basically he is reinforcing the idea that the military is number one, and everything else is dispensable.

This one year "pause" would be a big hit on programs that have already suffered cuts or less-than-inflationary growth.

Anti-science, anti-health, anti-education. McCain worries me.

apissedant said...

aunt judy,
I know, but I am tired of the rants. The duel rolls with completely bipolar comments is also getting old. We shouldn't reward dishonesty and retardation with attention. There are enough rational, intelligent, honest people here that I can disagree with more than enough to possibly bother giving Stop/Yam another minute of my attention

Leah Texas4Obama said...

UPDATED

So the list so far of things that Obama could use against McCain but probably WILL NOT since Obama has class:

1) The McCain/Bush hug

2) Cindy's drug use

3) Bomb, bomb, bomb Iran

4) "I will veto every single beer..."

5) McCain deserted his first wife, played the field then married a younger richer woman

6) McCain finished 5rd from the bottom of his class

7) Calling his wife the "c" word to her face

8) Vicke Iseman

9)

10)


p.s. To Beryl - 10. Calling the radical right crazy -- I am not familiar with that one, and I don't understand why wouldn't he use that one?

And maybe we should leave the last two blank until McCain makes two more big gaffes ;)

justin said...

Aunt Judy,

I'm not convinced it is Yams. As much as I didn't see eye to eye with her, I saw decidedly Dem ideas flicker through. There is more anger and more "Red" in the new troll.

Kujo said...

FYI, for the demconwatch bloggers.

I have officially removed my name from consideration for the VP Obama's position.

I've put much thought into the process and find that for now I can be more useful makeing sure that the radicals like stopobamanow are now going to have any influence in the 2008 campain.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Some of the newest polls on RealClearPolitics.com


Washington

Obama 53
McCain 35

Obama +18
______________

Massachusetts

Obama 53
McCain 30

Obama +23
______________

New York

Obama 50
McCain 36

Obama +14
_______________

Michigan

Obama 45
McCain 42

Obama +3
________________


Now that we don't have the superdelegates to track the only thing left are the polls :)

justin said...

Here is a nice map, but I think it is wrong on a few states.

RCP no tossup states

justin said...

A nice table on how McCain and Obamas tax plans will impact people of different income levels.

McCain tax breaks for wealthy

How can McCain mischaracterize Obama as increasing taxes for people of all backgrounds?

Leah Texas4Obama said...

DemConWatch has added a link at the top left of the page for the GENERAL ELECTION TRACKER.

If you scroll down a bit there to the top of the chart there are links to 538.com, electoral-vote.com, frontloaded, openleft, etc. They have maps there too.

I think a couple of the links are working though cause I had to go directly to electoral-vote.com NOT using their link.

Anyway there is tons of info and the DCW page and also on the pages the links take you to.

.

billyjay66 said...

Justin

Yamaka's last post on 5-28 around 9:30..... announced he was leaving for a trip Stop-Now then posted 1hr 38min later.... around 11:00 AM FOR THE VERY FIRST TIME ON THIS BLOG I viewed Stop's name and it had just been created....I was the second viewer. If they are not the same they are joined at the hip. The archive is there two threads back. Since yamaka has mellowed some they are obviously good cop bad cop.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

I kinda like this map the best...

http://www.electoral-vote.com/

you can move over the states and the poll numbers come up without having to click.

justin said...

Leah,
A wealth of info to keep me busy, thanks!

------------------------
BillyJay,
You're probably right, but that is a very convincing bad cop. The format and syntax are similar, too.

justin said...

Storm here getting more serious, I am shutting down the computer now. No worries for our safety, but frequent lightening.
night all

Bob in Vancouver said...

Leah Texas4Obama
and
Mike in Maryland

Geting back to your earlier comments about drugs, I get a bang out of commercials that feature a guy with a huge smile on his face telling everyone as proudly as he can, that he has Erectile Disfuncition (ED), and then the background voice goes on to say, "If you experience an errection lasting more than four hours, or if you have ringing in your ears, and blurred vision", get to a doctor quick.

I have a feeling that the guy in the commercial probably has the first of these symptoms.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

BY THE NUMBERS

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/06/by_the_numbers.html

.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Super Delegates


http://www.pbs.org/newshour/vote2008/primaries/superdelegates/search.php


Added June 9th for Obama

Rep. Mike McIntyre

Sen. Jack Reed

Rep. Anthony Weiner

When you go to the website look at the headings of the list and you can click on UPDATED and it will sort the newest additions to the top of the list.

Leah Texas4Obama said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Leah Texas4Obama said...

Okay, I am going way out there and I am going to say that Obama will win 345 electoral votes!

I think other than his solid states (CA, DC, HI, IL, MD, NY, RI, VT) he will also pick up...

Texas
Nevada
Indiana
Kansas (because of Sebelius)
Ohio (because of Sebelius)
Colorado
Virginia
New Mexico
Wisconsin
Maine
New Jersey
Pennsylvania
Massachusetts
New Hampshire
Minnesota
Iowa
Delaware
Oregon
Washington

I'm not sure if I listed them all but my guess is 345 total EVs.

345 - It will be a landslide!

Mike in Maryland said...

From The Hill:
"New Gang of 14 won’t back McCain"

Article tells of 2 R Senators and 12 R Congressperps who will not endorse McCain.

The breakdown is:
Senators
Chuck Hagel (Neb.)
Jeff Sessions (Ala.)

Reps
John Peterson (R-Pa.)
Walter Jones (R-N.C.)
John Doolittle (Calif.)
Randy Forbes (Va.)
Wayne Gilchrest (Md.)
Virgil Goode (Va.)
Tim Murphy (Pa.)
Ron Paul (Texas)
Ted Poe (Texas)
Todd Tiahrt (Kan.)
Dave Weldon (Fla.)
Frank Wolf (Va.)

http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/new-gang-of-14-wont-back-mccain-2008-06-11.html
http://tinyurl.com/6p26sh

Mike

suzihussein22 said...

Mike in MD-You ought to try to post that at Fox News. Maybe even post it on other relevant political blogs that favor Rep. Them's good news! :)

suzihussein22 said...

It's silly season, GE style-

http://www.dailykos.com/tag/Cheers%20and%20Jeers

suzihussein22 said...

They still couldn't make Obama look bad-

http://politicalhumor.about.com/od/barackobama/ig/Barack-Obama-Pictures/

apissedant said...

I changed my picture to the terrorist fist jab.

Beryl said...

Susan Rice - she was so on point today when discussing yesterday's comments on Morning Joe this AM.

McCain is getting all of the facts wrong so no one should trust him to make foreign policy decisions.

Karen Anne said...

I don't know if this is accurate, but...

I called the DNC contribution line this morning, because I know they need money, but I don't want any of my contribution to go to pay off Hillary's debt. Esp. since I read in the Times this morning that her big money donors are generally not supporting Obama.

The DNC lady said donations to the DNC would not go to Clinton.

ed iglehart said...

Beryl,

It's not unusual for Republican Presidents to not be in possession of the facts, or even to possess intellectual capacity, witness Reagan and Shrub. The GOP is well accustomed to operating glove puppets. McFootinmouth is just the latest, albeit, already losing his stuffing.

Sometimes it works pretty well, as with Reagan who was supported by fairly high quality operators, but with Shrub, the operators, though highly skilled, are also supremely corrupt, possessed of vicious agendas, and self-serving beyond imagination.

ed iglehart said...

With reference to the nest-lining activities of Shrub and Cheney and cronies:

BBC uncovers lost Iraqi Billions

For those in USA where freedom of the press is subject to suppressing "gag orders"
[quote]
"A BBC investigation estimates that around $23bn (£11.75bn) may have been lost, stolen or just not properly accounted for in Iraq.

The BBC's Panorama programme has used US and Iraqi government sources to research how much some private contractors have profited from the conflict and rebuilding.

A US gagging order is preventing discussion of the allegations.

The order applies to 70 court cases against some of the top US companies.

War profiteering

While Presdient George W Bush remains in the White House, it is unlikely the gagging orders will be lifted.

To date, no major US contractor faces trial for fraud or mismanagement in Iraq. [end quote]

xx
ed

Richard said...

Not only did stop show up just when yam left, he tried to play yam's old trick of responding to his own alias' posts, stop posting immediately after Yam to praise him, then when called as an alias stop denying that he was yam. We should all stop feeding the troll.

On anther note, I have a question for everyone: does anyone here think McCain has a chance of taking Michigan in November? All my predictions have been based on Michigan going to Obama, but polling seems to be showing lingering primary bitterness in the state...

Karen Anne said...

Richard,

Dunno about Michigan, but I am wondering about Louisiana and Mississippi. That photo of McCain, Bush, and a birthday cake the day Katrina hit is in wide circulation down there. Bush's name is dirt among even some longtime Republicans.

ed iglehart said...

FYI (especially Leah) - xx ed

The Case Against Kathleen Sebelius

On Wednesday, The Fix made the case for why Kathleen Sebelius should be tapped by Barack Obama to serve as his running mate. Today, the opposite argument.

Emit R Detsaw said...

The more McLame talks, the fewer States he will win. Other than Arian Nation States, I think Obama could take almost every State by the time November rolls around.

He bad on Foreign Policy
Bad for the Military
Pathetic on Economics
And Anti on Issues for the biggest voting block - Women

There were 3 women on the panel with Hardball last night. McShame has a Zero voting record on Womens Rights issues - Sad!

Dr. in Ann Arbor said...

Richard said:

On anther note, I have a question for everyone: does anyone here think McCain has a chance of taking Michigan in November? All my predictions have been based on Michigan going to Obama, but polling seems to be showing lingering primary bitterness in the state...

June 12, 2008 10:59 AM

As a Michigander, I can say that a) I see a LOT of Obama signs, b) with unemployment hitting 17% in some cities, I would think most people want someone who can create jobs, not ship more overseas, c) Obama has been here a bunch of times since he clinched. McCain, none. d) a LOT of people here didn't vote on election day because we knew it wouldn't count. We're itching to vote in November to make the Democratic voice heard.

Beryl said...

(State Roll-Call)
In Colorado, we are not hit as hard as many other states but we do have houses on the market for over one year. Additionally, we are sick of this deception-based war. Obama has huge support here so I am absolutely convinced that Obama will take Colorado.

Our neighbor to the north, Wyoming, probably won't turn blue in 2008 but it will come closer than ever before.

Mug said...

I saw on the news last night how Obama and McCain plan to attack each other.

Obama wants McCain to explain why he sided with credit institutions with regards to predadory lending practices.

McCain plans to get Obama into small town hall meetings and rehash the "bitter" comment. I guess he wants to keep Obama defending himself on what he said so he doesn't have to talk about the issues.

Using that same logic, I suppose Cindy McCain will be voting for Obama since her husband called her a cunt.

Richard said...

Dr. in Ann Arbor, I'm glad to hear from a Michigander on this topic. I had been confident in Obama's ability to catch up in Michigan, but with recent polling (even from after Hillary's concession) showing a close race I was getting worried.

ed iglehart said...

Genius move!

Well worth a visit. And, Here's Huffpost's take on it, complete with over sixty comments so far, including, of course, some smeary stuff.

:-)
ed
知 者 不 言。 言 者 不 知。

stopOBAMAnow said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
stopOBAMAnow said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ed iglehart said...

There's already a counter site to the stop the smears site!

Slimeballs can be quick too!

http://fightthesmears.org/

Enjoy!
;-)
ed

Beryl said...

I am praying that a virus hits that ungodly site and permanently brings it to its knees.

No one has the right to refute someone who professes to be a Christian. Bush is responsible for the death of over 1 million people based on a LIE yet he claims to be a Christian. We don't refute that and rightly so.

These people who are spreading lies against the Obamas are just plain evil and I'd like to witness them receiving their just punishment.

I'm sorry but this is something about which I feel strongly.

UUbuntu said...

Thanks, Ed. The especially amusing thing about that "fight the smears" site is that all of the links go to the same Youtube Rick Roll video -- which has nothing to do with the site!.

It's not really an anti-Obama site at all, or a pro-Obama site -- I don't know what it is, but it certainly isn't serious in any way!

ed iglehart said...

Anybody wanna give the guy a call?


MSNBC did a story with the WRONG LINK (.org) which is a counter-site and a fraud. The following is the PUBLICLY available information:

Registrant ID:GODA-049007738
Registrant Name:Kevin Martin
Registrant Street1:42 Kamper Ave
Registrant Street2:Apt 1
Registrant Street3:
Registrant City:Buffalo
Registrant State/Province:New York
Registrant Postal Code:14210
Registrant Country:US
Registrant Phone:+1.7168225654

Or, if he's a neighbour, you might want to go round and have a quiet word....

;-)
ed

ed iglehart said...

Or semnd him an email
fr_3@yahoo.com

知 者 不 言。 言 者 不 知。

Richard said...

I'm guessing that the Maria Martin that phone number is listed under is this twerp's mother. Maybe a polite call to her would get results?

Leah Texas4Obama said...

ed inglehart - thanks for the link regarding Sebelius. I really don't think Obama 'has to' pick a VP with foreign experience. Having enough people in his cabinet with foreign experience will suffice. And lets not forget that Senator Obama has a degree in Foreign Relations.

-------

Today on electoral-vote.com they are showing

Obama 304
McCain 221
Tie 13 (Virginia)

My guess is that on election day Obama will have 345 EVs :)

apissedant said...

The anti-Sebelius article seemed like a stretch. The only thing that really looks negative is her inability to make a public speech, and like they said, one speech is a poor measuring stick.

McCain has failed so many times on national security and foreign policy that his "experience" is not really a plus. He too often says incorrect things, and has made way too many publicly known bad choices. Experience is only good if proves you do the job well. Negative experience is actually a negative. I'll take an unknown over a failure any day.

Richard said...

One of the VP names that seems to pop up most frequently of late is that of Joe Biden. I have to say, I think he would make an excellent VP (or President...I was surprised he found no traction in the primaries) and his extensive foreign policy experience would be a good complement to Obama's strengths.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Let's just be careful to not publicize the wrong one too often and keep the real one out in the eyes of the public ;)


www.FightTheSmears.COM


Obama'08

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Obama has put his birth certificate online:

http://my.barackobama.com/page/invite/birthcert

Richard said...

Another thing I want to know is, with a war chest in the tens of millions, why in the world didn't Obama's campaign register every variation of fightthesmears available for a measly $10 a pop? Surely Obama's geeks know enough to do that. Isn't that basic practice when trying to stake out a claim in cyberspace?

JayW said...

Richard,

I 100% agree. I have shared my opinion on here many times that I think Joe Biden would make the strongest running mate for Obama.

Biden has a ton of senate time and a huge amount of foreign relations credential. Not to mention the fact that there is no way that the GOP could attack him. When he is attacked politically he comes out like a cornered pitbull. I think that would be a good thing since Obama always takes the high road when attacked. This way, we could really have the best of both worlds.

jpsedona said...

JayW,

I like Biden myself. The biggest knocks on him are a quick trigger (says things he later regrests) and the plagiarism issue that doomed his previous Presidential bid.

Independent Voter said...

Just a heads up. Anyone who normally doesn't watch Keith Olberman may want to tune into MSNBC around 8:45 Eastern Time. He has a "Special Comment" for John McCain.

I look forward to it.

Beryl said...

Independent - ITA. I've always enjoyed his "Special Comments". He is a phenomenal writer.

stopOBAMAnow said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
suzihussein22 said...

evening y'all...

ed iglehart- 11:24a.m.-Thanks for the opposition research on Sebelius. Perceptions can mean everything.

Beryl-deception based war-Nice term. Obama needs to reiterate that McCain supported it with Bush not being honest about needing to be there.

Joshua said...

I don’t know how old you guys are, but I am old enough to understand why Biden is a bad choice for anything other than Senator from Delaware. Did you ever wonder why he got nowhere this primary? Because his name is synonymous with plagiarism . Not only as a law student but also during his first run for the White House. That’s right. This was not his first run.


Also, he is a windbag. Put a microphone in front of him and you never know what is going to come out.


He voted for the Iraq war. How can you tout his judgment if he could not see that it was a wrong war at the wrong time against the wrong country? Don’t tell me we all thought Iraq war was a good idea. I certainly posted on the web at the time that it was the wrong war, an illegal and aggressive war. Obama also know it. Why didn’t Biden.


Also, Biden is wrong on the solution for Iraq. He is pushing the idea of dividing Iraq into 3 parts: Shia, Sunni and Kurd. That is a very stupid idea. Do you think Turkey is going to sit by and let that happen? Do you think Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and other Sunni Muslim states are going to sit back and let Persians kill off the Arab Sunnis in Iraq via the surrogate Shias? A very stupid idea indeed. I betcha that BushMcCain does not even know the difference between Persians and Arabs.


Biden knows nothing about foreign policy, in spite of his high office in the Senate. Trust me.

Joshua said...

Sorry, Sebelius is bad for VP. What is it about people who just want to put a woman in the White House? Whatever her good qualifications, AMERICA IS NOT READY FOR TWO “MINORITIES” IN ONE TICKET. Why is that so hard to understand?

Leah Texas4Obama said...

McCain's town hall on Fox tonight...

1) He told Fox that Repubs, Independents, and Democrats would be in the audience. As it turned out the people in the audience were only Republican supporters, Bloomberg, and some other Indies, NO Democrats. Good thing that Obama did not show up!

2) Why is the media making such a big thing about McCain doing town halls. Obama has been doing them for several months - with 'ordinary' people in barns, in parks, factories, at VFW halls, etc.

3) Not one person that I could see at McCain's town hall had on a t-shirt. Most of them looked like they were dressed up to go to church!

4) I saw only the last half of the townhall and it didn't seem like McCain was very specific. Obama is much more specific in his townhalls.

OBAMA/Sebelius '08

Karen Anne said...

My concern about a woman VP is that we don't get another Geraldine Ferraro, unqualified and picked only for gender. I doubt Obama would do anything like that though.

She was an extreme case, but we need real gravitas in the VP. I like Napiolitano or Olympia Snowe, who is a kind of rino, if she would change parties.

Not Jim Webb, with his horrible sexist past.

I like Biden, but I am wondering why he didn't endorse earlier. Has he even endorsed yet?

The military guys who were dragged out as possibilities a day or so ago, I'm just not impressed. Why pick someone with no name recognition and no political background, and not bringing any states to the ticket.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Mike-

This is 2008 - women are not minorities.

Governor Kathleen Sebelius is just as qualified to be VP as some of the other possibilities. I think she would be a wonderful addition to Obama's ticket for several reasons and none of them are 'only' because she is a woman.

She would help with Kansas and Ohio.

She doesn't have a truck load of baggage.

She has experience.

She has an aura about her of integrity and dignity.

She looks good on stage with Obama.

She gets along well with Obama.

She has extensive knowledge of the insurance industry.

She has experience of running a state and getting that state out of debt.

She is a world traveler that will bring a different perspective to the table.

And a lot of other things... go look them up for yourself!

.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Kansas Governor Kathleen Sebelius

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kathleen_Sebelius

http://www.governor.ks.gov/

.

Joshua said...

Karen,

No Biden has yet to endorse. He did not endorse because he is a wuss. He wanted to make sure not to upset the Clintons. I’ve got news for him: he does not need to worry about the Clintons; he needs to worry about Obama. FYI, Obama has moved the headquarters of the DNC to Chicago. And Biden is worried about upsetting the Clintons.

Joshua said...

Leah

The term “minority” was in quotes. It means: two firsts at the same time. I don’t wish to argue this point. The ticket may appeal to you and me, but the rest of America is not ready for it. Peace.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

One problem is that if Obama 'does not' put a woman on the ticket with him at the August convention, then McCain might put a woman on his in September.

Then there will be a lot of women that won't be looking at the issues but will base their vote on gender (which is the wrong thing to do).

apissedant said...

Pat Buchanan and this other Republican is an idiot....

"John McCain and the Republicans are ahead, because they're only down by six points?"

apissedant said...

should have been, "are idiots"

apissedant said...

Pat Buchanan understands regular Americans, and understands history. Barack is some silly liberal that doesn't understand us regular people or our history.

Independent Voter said...

LOL p'd ant - I love the satire.

Independent Voter said...

I can't believe you are using the "terrorist fist jab" as your avatar

Beryl said...

Pat Buchanan called Barack "exotic"

WTF is "exotic" about him? He is an American -- just like everyone else.

Independent Voter said...

WOW!!!! Get 'em Keith.

Beryl said...

Keith O. showed a pic with Bush Sr. doing the "terrorist jab" with a tennis player. LOL!

apissedant said...

Dave,
LOL... I can't believe this crap flies on television. Do these women get to talk at some point?

Dan Abrams is being good today though, normally I'm not a huge fan.

7 of 9 of the Justices are Republican appointed.

THAT DUDE JUST SAID IT IS OK BECAUSE WE HAVE THE GENEVA CONVENTION!!!! THEY SAID IT (THE GENEVA CONVENTION) DOESN'T APPLY BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT SOLDIERS!!!

Leah Texas4Obama said...

I can't stand Pat Buchanan.
Every time he says "What's the matter with Barack Obama" (which it seems like he says everyday) I wanna smack him!

EXOTIC - was used as a sly code word and Pat didn't wiggle out of it either!

WOW - Dan Abrams has gone almost 30 minutes without mentioning Hillary! This must be a record for him ;)

Independent Voter said...

p'd ant - I hear ya. I do like Dan Abrams though. The only thing that I don't like about him, is that over the past 2 weeks he's been trying to shove Clinton down our throats as VP.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Ooops - Abrams brought up the Clintons. He record lasted only 27 minutes!

Independent Voter said...

Leah - LOL!!!! I hear ya, someone just simply needs to shove a sock down Buchanan's throat and leave it there.

LOL about your Hillary comment....I was thinking the same thing.

Independent Voter said...

Leah - he didn't actually bring them up, he was just showing a segment on CNN that Jack was basically trying to tell Wolfie to shut the hell up. That she was last weeks news...LOL

:)

Independent Voter said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Independent Voter said...

Since when are confused and out of code words referring to being ageism?

Beryl said...

Some of the most confused among us are YOUNG PEOPLE! McCain confused the facts and the word is an appropriate description.

Democrats have to be careful..."when they start using words like senile and dementia, then they are in trouble", Abrams

I love it!

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Well it doesn't really matter what words they use because McCain IS OLD, confused, and out of touch! LOL ;)

But the Obama camp HAS NOT used the age card. The words 'Out of touch', 'confused', and 'lost his bearings' has NOTHING to do with age.

But I do think McCain's troubles are due to his age ;)

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Now what the heck are they talking about !!!

Obama's RCP avg in New Jersey is +11

McCain doesn't have a chance in New Jersey LOL.

They sure can spin the truth!

apissedant said...

YES! This chick is a genius. NJ was called a toss up state in 2004, and Dems took it by 7 points, and that was an election we lost terribly.

As for Abrams, yeah, that's kinda why I don't like him too much. That, and when he talked about everyone bashing Clinton yesterday or the day before... he played clips from CNN and Fox News, and completely ignored all of the MSNBC people that were bashing Clinton. That was hypocritical and BS.

Independent Voter said...

LOL Beryl and Leah.

I really wish they would play the senility and dementia cards. After all, you don't have to be old to have those conditions, but his age doesn't help. :)

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Speaking of age...


Italian Prime Minister Backs McCain: "I Would No Longer Be Oldest Person" At International Meetings

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2008/06/12/citing_his_age_italian_prime_m.html

------

ROME -- It's not clear this is the kind of international endorsement Sen. John McCain is looking for.

Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi, a charismatic figure who often hams it up with the press, waded into the U.S. presidential race on Thursday by saying he preferred McCain because then Berlusconi would no longer be the eldest leader at international meetings.

"I suppose I could express my own personal preference for one of the candidates, the Republican candidate," Berlusconi said. "And this is for a very selfish reason, and that is that I would no longer be the oldest person at the upcoming G-8 because McCain is a month older than me."

The controversial Italian leader, who recently returned to power again, even went on to rattle off his and McCain's birthdates to prove the point.

Oh, and one more thing: The man standing beside him at Villa Madama when he made the remarks was President Bush, who is in the midst of an 8-day farewell trip through Europe and the United Kingdom. Bush chuckled, but didn't address the endorsement in his own remarks.

Independent Voter said...

Why are we replaying the OJ "car chase?"

Why is the douchebag OJ being given ANY recognition at this point?

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Italy just can't seem to get rid of Berlusconi (every time they get him out of office he gets back in) ... just like the Bushes and Clintons!

Obama/Sebelius '08

Independent Voter said...

LOL LEAH!!!!!!!!!!! ROFL!

If that is the ONLY reason he wants McCain, then why don't we ship McCain over to him? Let them be stuck with the old fart.

That is not to say that all 70+ people are old farts, I'm specifically referring to just John McCain. I don't think we have any 70+ ers on this thread, if we do, please don't take offense :)

Independent Voter said...

OMFG!!!!!!!!!! NO WAY!!!!!!!

Lou Dobbs as Governor for NJ?

NO F'ING WAY!!!!!!!!!

Beryl said...

My mom is over 70 and I have mad respect for her competence. She carries a Treo and text messages with the best of them.

HOWEVER, McCain's trouble is not his age but his judgment and character. He is oblivious to the information age and how his words and actions will come back to bite him in the butt.

Jokes aside, McCain is just plain dangerous and should never be the Commander In Chief. The Republicans know this but they are stuck with him.

Independent Voter said...

Beryl,

Whew! I'm glad I qualified my response...LOL

Emit R Detsaw said...

Been having fun over on a blog that is full of Obama haters. It is mainly a handful of crusty old Vets, but in just a couple short days I already got Emit R Detsaw in the title of a Blog attacking me for saying that Bush and his Cronies lied to get the US into the war. It is too easy getting them spun up. Good news, most of them already don't like the ideal of crazy old McCain. Some are leaning towards Barr.

[url="http://www.vajoe.com/board/viewforum.php?id=106"]VAJoe Blog[/url]

Emit R Detsaw said...

Oops, embedded link got a bit messed up. Hum.....

suzihussein22 said...

Just when you think they couldn't get any lower-

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25129598/

they outdo themselves. Now they just need to fire themselves! Would Trump like that honor?

Independent Voter said...

HA!!!!!!

BUDWEISER brewer Anheuser-Busch has little option but to accept the takeover bid it received from Belgian rival InBev, although it should hold out for a higher price, experts said yesterday.

Cindy must be a little pissed

Independent Voter said...

SS - I saw that earlier. I swear to God those creeps really need to be SHOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Actually that is too good for them. They need to waterboarded for weeks on end and then hung up by their balls.

suzihussein22 said...

Not too important? This is an older Memorial Day strip of Doonesbury, but I'm going to get this on a Rep. blog somehow-

http://bp3.blogger.com/_alh8JTwprEw/RmMu1vnsnDI/AAAAAAAAAeo/Uefx1mbluFY/s1600-h/070603.doonesbury.gif

apissedant said...

"That it is better 100 guilty Persons should escape than that one innocent Person should suffer, is a Maxim that has been long and generally approved."

Benjamin Franklin
A Founding Father, and a signer and contributor to the Constitution of the United States of America.



Approximately 500 detainees have been released from Guantanamo or transferred to other governments since the facility opened in January 2002.
the Defense Intelligence Agency has estimated that as many as three dozen former Guantanamo detainees are confirmed or suspected of having returned to terrorist activities.
International human rights groups and lawyers for Guantanamo detainees have disputed that estimate, saying only a handful of former detainees have left U.S. custody and gone on to fight U.S. forces.

Washington Post,
Respected news organization relying on federal government and defense department releases.




And certainly not the American people, who today lose a bit more control over the conduct of this Nation’s
foreign policy to unelected, politically unaccountable judges.
John Roberts

Chief Justice of the Supreme Court and supposed "strict constructionist"


The game of bait-and-switch that today’s opinion plays upon the Nation’s Commander in Chief will make the war harder on us. It will almost certainly cause more Americans
to be killed. That consequence would be tolerable if necessary to preserve a time-honored legal principle vital to our constitutional Republic. But it is this Court’s blatant
abandonment of such a principle that produces the decision today.
Their return to the kill illustrates the incredible difficulty of assessing who is and who is not an enemy combatant in a foreign theater of operations where the environment does not lend itself to rigorous evidence collection. Astoundingly, the Court today raises the bar, requiring military officials to appear before civilian courts and defend their decisions under procedural and evidentiary rules that go beyond what Congress has specified.

Justice Scalia, another supposed "strict constructionist"

suzihussein22 said...

independent voter- Yeah, but it's debatable whether they have any.

apissedant said...

Oh, and buy CJ Roberts a thesaurus, I have never seen the word contrary so many times in one paper. And what type of legal document uses words like, "quirky", "Turns out they were just kidding." and continually has the two most junior justices continually calling the majority, "wrong", "mistaken", "misread", counterproductive, and a million other insults, and then ends with:
"I respectfully dissent"

Do these pricks no what respectfully means? Buy all four of them dictionaries too. Our court hasn't always been this partisan, petty, and insulting. Justice Burger started this crap.

Mike in Maryland said...

I just sent Fox News Channel an email about the "baby momma" graphic:

Does the producer 'responsible' for the "baby momma" graphic know what that term means?

Is he/she the child of a "baby momma"? I'd wager that he/she is!!!!!! (The polite term is 'illegitimate'. I think most people know the 'street' term.)

Aunt Jean said...

Leah

To begin with because McCain is such a sexist I don't believe that he would put a woman on the ticket. As far as Sebelius if Obama put her on the ticket I believe he will be making a grave error. I know it will piss off a lot of Clinton supporters. I know that you like her and I really don't know anything about her just the fact that she is a woman. They will hold that against Obama. I know that you believe it won't I'm telling you it will. Jean

Aunt Jean said...

Mike in maryland to be honest I've never heard of the term baby momma. I've always heard the term a love child.I guess I'm way behind times. Jean

Independent Voter said...

Leah,

I have to concur with Aunt Jean on this one, regarding Sebelius.

Don't get me wrong, I really do like Sebelius and I personally believe that she has better experience than Clinton, but at the same time I believe there would be a huge backlash if he chose her. Even though she is (IMO) a better choice, the perception would be that she would simply be seen as another Geraldine Ferraro...only put there because she's a woman (which I don't think that would be the reason he would pick her) but that would be the perception of Clinton supporters as well as MSM.

Aunt Jean said...

Leah did you read an article in the Houston chronicle that they wanted to impeach Bush but couldn't because of some kind of law or something. My mother was telling me about it. She said my brother was telling her about. Do you know if there is any truth in it or have you heard anything about it? Jean

Mike in Maryland said...

Jean,

That's exactly why the term is so offensive - it was not a well-known term outside the 'street talk' people (although now it is much more well-known). I didn't know what it meant precisely, but knowing it was on Fox, I could have guessed what it meant, and guessed it wasn't put up there in a positive manner.

The 'producer responsible' for the graphic had to know what it meant, otherwise why put it in the graphic? After all, it is not a commonly-known term to the general public.

Who would that graphic have been aimed at? Supporters of Senator Obama, and specifically a very specific portion of those supporters - those of a certain ethnic and socio-economic spectrum (and I bet you can figure out exactly who it was aimed at now that you know some of the relevant info).

Mike

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Aunt Jean,

No matter what Obama does there are going to be people that will find fault with his decision.

If he picks a man then some people will say that he is not giving a woman a shot at being in the White House.

He should pick the person that he believes will do the best job and a person that he can get along with for the next 4 - 8 years.

I think it is unfair to all the other female Senators and Governors to say that they should not be considered.

By him picking a female as a running mate would help push Hillary's agenda of getting a female in the White House. We don't know right now if Hillary even really wants to be VP and she might even like the idea of Obama putting another woman on the ticket.

We will just have to wait to hear what Senator Obama's decision will be and then everyone should respect his decision no matter what his choice is.



.

Aunt Jean said...

Mike in maryland that was very tacky and insulting. Jean

Mike in Maryland said...

Jean,

Re: the impeachment of Shrub - Rep. Dennis Kucinich introduced a resolution this week, with 35 counts. It was read twice - IN FULL - on the floor of the House before being sent to committee.

You can get a lot of info on the issue by going to Google, clicking "News" at the top of the page, then entering "impeachment Kucinich" in the search box.

Mike

Independent Voter said...

Aunt Jean - "love baby" usually referred to the "illegitimate" child, while baby mama refers to the woman who had the "illegitimate" child.

Fox, using the phrase "Obama baby mama" implies that they were not married when their first daughter or both daughters were born. Therefore having a derogatory connotation toward Michelle.

Aunt Jean said...

Mike in maryland I would have just thought it meant as an endearment for a woman who you love that you share a child with. I guess it was silly of me to think that's what it meant. Jean

Beryl said...

Yeah, it is pretty sad that Sebelius who is already 60 years old must "wait" because of another woman who is the same age and has (IMO) less experience. Doesn't seem fair to Sebelius.

I will not doubt what Aunt Jean is saying. She knows the thinking of those who are faithful to Sen. Clinton.

Obama's advisors are probably balancing the lost of Hillary supporters with the loss of other Suburban women (Reagan Dems).

Independent Voter said...

Aunt Jean Mike in maryland that was very tacky and insulting. Jean

Huh? What was tacky and insulting?

He was simply making an observation to Fox's demographics.

With their people making "gaffes" so often lately - E.D. Hill's comment referring to the fist pump as a "terrorist fist jab" and the one woman saying that Obama should be shot. I don't think it is too far of a stretch to say that they knew EXACTLY what they were doing. They KNOW exactly who their demographics are, and they are pandering heavily toward that demographic.

Mike in Maryland said...

Aunt Jean said...
Mike in maryland that was very tacky and insulting.

Jean,

What?

My email to Fox, or what Fox did to cause me to write the email?

You need to be more specific in a lot of your responses to people. That is one reason many people take issue with what you write - many times you word your messages in such a way that two, three or more meanings can easily be inferred. When someone is already in an argumentative mood, the wording of your messages does not calm the situation.

Now, again, was it my email to Fox, or what Fox did to cause me to write the email that you consider 'very tacky and insulting'?

Mike

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Aunt Jean,

I did not read the Houston Chronicle article.

But the Impeachment Resolution was read into the record in the House of Representatives Monday evening by Kucinich and again on Tuesday by someone else.

Here is one article:

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/06/11/kucinich.impeach/index.html?eref=rss_topstories

and you can find more articles if you do a search for

Kucinich Bush Impeachment

.

Aunt Jean said...

Dave but in todays culture having a child or children out of wedlock is so common. It doesn't make that person bad. I'm not saying that it's true just silly to make a big deal over. I'm not saying that it's better just more common. It's always better for the child to have two loving parents.Jean

Aunt Jean said...

Leah thanks for the link. I've been gone all day and haven't had a chance to research it. I appreciate it. jean

Independent Voter said...

Aunt Jean - Dave but in todays culture having a child or children out of wedlock is so common. It doesn't make that person bad. I'm not saying that it's true just silly to make a big deal over. I'm not saying that it's better just more common. It's always better for the child to have two loving parents.Jean

---

You have to remember though, this is still presidential politics. Remember what happened in 2000 when Bush ran a campaign of dirty political tactics (LIED) about McCain having an illegitimate black child. It killed his bid for the presidency at that time. It didn't come out until later that it was indeed a lie.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Barack and Michelle were married 'several years' before their first daughter was born - so I really don't see why FoxNews did, or would even think of doing, such a disrespectful thing.

.

Aunt Jean said...

Mike in Maryland we were taking about momma baby and that is what I was talking about them calling Michelle Mamma baby. I thought that was tacky and insulting for them to do that. I'm sorry if you thought I was talking about something else. Jean

Independent Voter said...

Leah, I agree with you. It is absolutely absurd, but like I said to Jean, With their people making "gaffes" so often lately - E.D. Hill's comment referring to the fist pump as a "terrorist fist jab" and the one woman saying that Obama should be shot. I don't think it is too far of a stretch to say that they knew EXACTLY what they were doing. They KNOW exactly who their demographics are, and they are pandering heavily toward that demographic.

Independent Voter said...

LOL - I think Mike and I both thought you meant HE was being tacky and insulting.....LOL

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Independent voter-

I wasn't paying attention the last time McCain ran but why the heck didn't he just hold a press conference and debunk the smear. The daughter they adopted was from an orphanage that Mother Theresa worked at. It seems to me if he had come out publicly and told the true story at the time he would have racked up some brownie points ;)

Thank goodness Senator Obama set up the new website to fight the smears that are coming his way.

www.FightTheSmears.COM

Btw, there is a copy of his birth certificate there and also a video of him leading the Pledge of Allegiance in the Senate and some other good things there.
.

Mike in Maryland said...

Aunt Jean,

For some info on the term 'baby momma', take a look at this NPR article from May 24, 2005:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4663047
http://tinyurl.com/dpk3r

The term is at least three years old, and comes from the, shall we say, 'non-white side of the population spectrum'.

In other words, Fox using its usual method of using code words when it wants to get a point out, but try to have some 'cover' when caught at it. Think of how 'states rights' is misused by many as a cover for segregation; 'biblical truth' is used by people who are against scientific knowledge; etc.

Mike

Aunt Jean said...

Beryl


Yeah, it is pretty sad that Sebelius who is already 60 years old must "wait" because of another woman who is the same age and has (IMO) less experience. Doesn't seem fair to Sebelius.


I agree that it is sad and even go as far as to say unfair but you know yourself a lot of times life isn't fair. I have to believe that she [Sebelius] is a good person but sometimes good people finish last. Jean

Independent Voter said...

Leah, he did hold a press conference and tried debunking it, but it was too late, the damage had been done. It's nearly impossible to debunk a negative when there is zero evidence to support the positive charge.

Meaning, someone can say that I have a biological child out there somewhere (impossible since I've never had sex with a female). It is impossible to negate that charge if there isn't a child to take a DNA sample from. And if the person making the claim doesn't produce the evidence (the child in question) then it would be impossible to negate the charge. That is what happened in 2000.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Here is an enlarged version of Obama's birth certificate:

http://images.dailykos.com/images/user/3/BO_Birth_Certificate.jpg


.

Aunt Jean said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Aunt Jean said...

Dave I really should be more careful.Can I claim it happens because I'm a twin when we talk we finish each others thoughts. Yes I'm an identical twin LOL!Jean

Independent Voter said...

Aunt Jean - LOL! It got cleared up :) No harm no foul.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

DCW put the updated General Election Tracker on the front page.

I think that Obama is going to win 30 states to McCain's 20.

Should we start a contest to guess how many EVs Obama - McCain are going to end up with?

And if we don't start it now when should we?

.

Independent Voter said...

LOL!!!!!! I totally just got called out (no not by name) by Billy Ikner (sp?) on the Bravo A-List awards. He just said, "you are probably gay or a woman, because you are watching the first annual Bravo A-List awards.."

LOL!!!!!!

Kathy Griffin is a RIOT!!!!!!!!

tmess2 said...

You know it's too bad that this terrorist fist jab claim came up during the summer.

I would love to see SNL doing a skit on Howie Mandel as the newest prisoner at Guantanamo.

Aunt Jean said...

Leah

I'm not trying to insult you in your choise for VP. I've done some research on Sebelius and listened to her and she seems to be very nice and she has done a lot [sorry but I think Hillary has done more personal opinion] I'm looking at it through Hillary supporters eyes. But you know it really doesn't matter what we think it's who Obama thinks is best. I guess we will have to wait and see who he picks. I just happen to believe very strongly that he would be making a grave error if he picks a woman. Is that right probable not but that's the way I think it will be. Jean

tmess2 said...

I have one question about this AOL straw poll that our favorite split personality is quoting. Is this the same straw poll that Ron Paul was leading all last fall?

Leah Texas4Obama said...

WOW - Right now on HuffPost the headline is:

The World Waits For President Obama

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/


Talk about having some pressure on ya when you know the whole world is waiting ;)

Richard said...

I am appalled (I was going to say shocked, but...yeah, right) by that Fox graphic. Arrgh.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

tmess2 -

I don't know about the Ron Paul poll... but I do know that the polls 'online' are not reliable because people can cheat and vote more than once. The only polls I pay attention to are the ones they collect over on RealClearPolitics.com and some of the ones they use on the electoral vote maps.

.

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Some of ya'll may have noticed that DCW has changed to a new commenting procedure on some of the newer threads.

In order to log in on those newer threads you will see a little icon that says 'intense debate' under the new text box where you enter your comment. You go to that site and set up a name and password, etc. and you can upload your photo there too. It took me awhile to figure it out ;)

You can actually post with out logging in on some of those other threads but you won't have a photo and you won't be able to delete any of your own posts, etc. unless you login.

Probably when the OPEN THREAD gets too big they will change to the new format here too. So I thought I'd give ya'll a heads up.

.

Mike in Maryland said...

As if McSame doesn't already have enough problems coming from the far right side of the political spectrum (with Bob Barr as the 'official' Libertarian Party candidate), Ron Paul is stirring up more problems on the far right.

From The Dallas Morning News:
"Ron Paul launches libertarian movement"

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/news/politics/national/stories/061308dnpolronpaul.28203de2.html
http://tinyurl.com/65a7uq

As to the right-wingers, all I'll say is 'the more [different parties and arguing factions] the merrier!'

Mike

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Mike in Maryland-

I am hoping that all the Democrats and most of the independents will get behind Senator Obama and then everyone else can divide themselves up between McCain, Nader, Barr, and Ron Paul.

The more votes taken away from McCain the better ;)

We might even pick up a couple of extra red states that way ;)

RobH said...

Leah,

Your belief that an Obama-Sebelius ticket could pick up IN, KS, and NV has a VERY NICE geographic implication. On that map, an American could drive from Boston to LA without ever crossing a red state (with the exception of AZ, - the home state of the red team's candidate.)

NICE!

I'll take 317 in the EV pool. I've watched the map slowly come around to just where I hoped it would be (MO, then OH, then MI, each turning blue in their turn.) The last shoe to drop will ne VA, then we're at the 317 I've been pointing towards.

I would love to think we could pick up a Carolina, or one of the Katrina impacted states (LA or MS.) The recent congressional special elections there are a reason for hope, but somehow I think the deeply seated traditional stuff will still hold sway there. It's true, the youth ar ALL OVER this campaign, and will carry the day in Nov, just not in these places. The most likely of your proposed pick-ups (IMO) is NV. Vegas should come through for the Dems, narrowly overcoming the 'proximity to AZ retirement types for McScary'.
So I could see 322, put I'll stick with 317. (You see, I want to be 'first one out again'....)

jpsedona said...

Leah,

Sebelius may meet the qualifications to be VP but she lacks the experience to be President, IMO.

I like to consider how a candidate would do across the table in a meeting with Kruzchev. I could see Hillary going toe-to-toe; but Sebelius? no way. It's a toughness issue... and Obama has a cloud over him now on whether he's tough enough to be President.

She is not only a lightweight on national experience; but she comes across as "too reserved".

Sebelius would be a better choice than Dan Quayle was for George the first. But the choice would be second guessed between the convention & GE by every Hillary supporter & the mainstream media. It would come down to comparison between the two ladies. You don't want 2 weeks of coverage comparing Sebelius to Hillary coming out of the convention. It steals the spotlight from the general campaign, and that could do the cempaign in.

IMO Sebelius doesn't bring much to the ticket. She has executive experience but that's not Obama's weakest element. Obama needs someone with broader experience on foreign policy and/or economy.

stopOBAMAnow said...

As per the AOL Straw Poll today
(aol.com) 56% favor McCAin to 44% for BHO. 495 K people voted all across US.

This gives BHO less than 172 EVs! McCain gets more than 352 EVs.

Watch this poll daily. This tells the whole story.

Stop Obama Now. He is Carter II.

stopOBAMAnow said...

"I am hoping that all the Democrats and most of the independents will get behind Senator Obama"

This is a pipe dream!

Only 18 million plus 6 million of HRC voters plus another 10 million Radical Liberals will vote for Carter II.

Obama is inexperienced as Bush and a bleeding liberal like Carter II.

Stop Obama Now. To Save America.

Independent Voter said...

Stop - I think you have been misguided to this website. I think the one you are looking for is HERE

Dilbuck said...

So I just got a bull crap republican e-mail about statements in Barack's books about the "racist" sentences. However, like always, it only showed a single sentence and not the entire paragraph. How unusual? Is there a e-mail address where I can send this to the Obama campaign so they can start putting it on the smear site.

Richard said...

How long do you think Stop had to search to find a poll so utterly invalid that it would support his delusions? Sometimes it's really hard not to feed the trolls.

Independent Voter said...

Richard,

Stop probably has it bookmarked so it doesn't take him long at all.

The only problem is that it is a "straw poll" which anyone can go and vote. Totally unscientific because there is absolutely zero randomness to it. It is the same people voting in the poll every week.

ed iglehart said...

Dilbuck,

Forward the email to
watchdog@barackobama.com

Instructions

Salaam, etc.
ed

Leah Texas4Obama said...

Dilbuck -

On Obama's new anti-smear site

www.FightTheSmears.COM

has a section on there about 'quotes taken from books'. They have FOUR quotes listed that have showed up in smear emails.

Hope that helps you.

.

Richard said...

IV - I actually now realize it would not have been hard for a Republican troll like Stop to find that poll. It has apparently been making the rounds of the Republican talk shows...

ed iglehart said...

Dilbuck,

Link should be
mailto:watchdog@barackobama.com

(I think)

ed iglehart said...

watchdog@barackobama.com

Third attempt

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