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Update: MPR has notes on the recounts at various locations today. And they also have a great selection of challenged ballots that we can all have an opinion on.
With 18% of the votes counted, Coleman lost 86 votes, and Franken lost 45 votes, for a net gain for Franken of 41 votes, cutting the lead to 174.However, Coleman has challenged more ballots, 146 to 123 for Franken. If you assume each ballot has a 50% chance of being approved, than Coleman could gain back a net 11-12 votes. But who knows if that assumption is real. The Coleman challenges could have a lower threshold than the Franken challenges, which would mean a lower % of their challenged ballots might be approved. Are new Franken voters more likely to to not have filled out their ballot correctly? It's really hard to tell.
The above was due to a misunderstanding of what a challenged ballot is. Ballots are placed in 3 piles: Coleman, Franken, or novote/other vote. Franken, for example, could challenge a ballot going into Coleman's pile (Challenge Type A), or he could challenge a ballot he would like to go into his own pile but went into the "no vote" pile (Challenge Type B). If we assume all the lost votes are due to Type A challenges, we can do a little math.
Assume 75% of the Type A challenges are allowed. This seems reasonable, as the recount officials felt they should be allowed. Coleman gains back 64, Franken gains back 34, for Coleman +30.
The rest are Type B challenges. Coleman has 146 - 45 (Franken lost votes) = 101. Franken has 123 - 86 (Coleman lost votes) = 37. Assume 25% of these votes get allowed. Coleman picks up a net 16, For a total net challenges gain of 46. Which gives him a net gain on the day of +5.
Let us know what you think of this analysis.
Also, Franken did win a potentially significant court case today, giving them information on voters whose absentee ballots were rejected.
Long Island Democrat · 854 weeks ago
Miller · 854 weeks ago
So if i have this straight, of the 18 percent they counted today, there are now 131 pending votes that they haven't awarded to either candidate?
tmess2 70p · 854 weeks ago
I don't think there is any good count as to the reasons for the challenges, so we don't know if they were ballots with votes for the opposing candidate that were "erroneously" proposed to be counted or if they were votes fro the challenging candidate that were "erroneously" proposed to be excluded.
The labels used by the Secretary of State on his website contribute to the confusion by describing Franken's challenges as "Coleman and other ballots challenged by Franken" and describing Coleman's challenges as "Franken and other ballots challenged by Coleman."
Unless the MST has someone observing each table tracking and reporting how the challenges break down, I don't think we have a way of determining how many of each candidate's challenges are ballots they want kept out and how many are ballots they want added in.
tmess2 70p · 854 weeks ago
Tom 53p · 854 weeks ago
Tom 53p · 854 weeks ago
Coleman challenged 146 ballots. We assume that 80% - 117 were votes for Franken and 85% will uphold and go to Franken - 100 votes. The other 29 challenged votes are a try for Coleman to add to his own. 30% success - 9 votes for Coleman.
Franken campaign challenged 123 ballots. 70% are presumably cast for Coleman - 85% of that uphold - 73 votes for Coleman. 30% are a try for Franken - 30% success of 37 - 11 more for Franken.
Total Franken 100 + 11 = 111
Total Coleman 73 + 9 = 82
Net gain Franken 29 votes
That will make the total for the day about 75 votes gain for Franken
Remember: the more challenges by Coleman - the more votes for Franken
Tom 53p · 854 weeks ago
CA Pol Junkie · 854 weeks ago
Tom 53p · 854 weeks ago
Chad_Nielson 57p · 854 weeks ago
Tom 53p · 854 weeks ago
Fisch Fry · 854 weeks ago
But -- if the challenges are largely of Type A -- then Franken has also added in up to 100 new votes. So, he's closed about half the gap with more than 80% of the vote uncounted. It's in those new votes where the gap will be made up, but the trendline would suggest there might be another five hundred new votes for Franken. More than enough to make up the 200 vote difference at the start of the recount.
Assuming ya'll are right that the vast majority of the challenges are Type A challenges...
Charles · 854 weeks ago
* If we only look at the precincts that have already reported. I project the count difference will be +128 (that is Franken gains by 128 votes). These precincts account for 72% of all the votes.
* If I assume that we take into account all of the precincts, and assume that the voting trend is the same for those that have not started the counting yet then the count difference is +210-235 (I'm predicting between 210 and 235 through analysis by two different methods.
In any case, considering the current difference is currently ~200 votes pre-recount (in favor of Coleman), then this recount is likely to make the situation "worse". i.e. the recount will leave us with a difference that will be incredibly small and probably encourage lawsuits, etc.
Any questions?
Charles.
uplandpoet 69p · 854 weeks ago
Tom 53p · 854 weeks ago
uplandpoet 69p · 854 weeks ago
Eric · 854 weeks ago
Eric · 854 weeks ago
http://www.senate.gov/artandhistory/history/minut...
uplandpoet 69p · 854 weeks ago
Tom 53p · 854 weeks ago
tmess2 70p · 854 weeks ago
On the "underline" ballot, that looked more like a strike-through (i.e. cancelling the vote) than an underline.
There seemed to be a lot of stray marks that folks were trying to claim were votes.
Oreo 51p · 854 weeks ago
http://www.demconwatchblog.com/2008/11/minnesota-...
Mquist · 854 weeks ago
Mquist · 854 weeks ago